This is a very rare Ross automatic pistol, patented in 1903 by Charles Ross, of the Ross Rifle Company in Quebec. It is a short recoil, toggle locked design, made for the .45 Ross proprietary cartridge (although efforts were made, unsuccessfully, to make a .45 ACP version for the US 1907 pistol trials).
I have photos of a second example of this pistol as well!
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I suppose that manufacturing costs and load tolerances shot down the Ross pistol. The toggle is not intended for varying powder loads and like the Luger, the Ross would probably suffer a failure to extract if fed the wrong ammunition. The saving grace is that there is no hammer bite. Was I wrong?
“suffer a failure to extract if fed the wrong ammunition”
But this is true for all automatic and self-loading weapons, if you want to use automatic or self-loading weapon you must be able to deliver ammunition of good enough quality.
Even if it extracted and ejected as designed, I suspect that the ejection geometry was an Achilles’ heel.
Unless the empty case followed a very precise path on its way out (straight up and slightly forward would be my guess), it was almost guaranteed to hit the toggle and be deflected straight back down into the boltway, resulting in a smokestack jam or even a double feed.
The original Bren Ten CZ-75 clone had similar problems, due to being a 9 x 19mm sized platform adapted to a nearly .41 Magnum sized cartridge. I am aware of at least one such that consistently extracted the fired round, but in attempting to eject it bounced it off the inside of the slide top, resulting in the empty case being reinserted into the top of the magazine, and re-fed every time. Making it a semi-automatic single-shot.
I suspect this setup would have had similar problems. Not due to too large a cartridge, but simply due to the peculiar geometry of the bolt/toggle system.
It does however illustrate a basic principle of self-loader design often overlooked by designers. That being, “During the ejection phase, make sure that the empty has a wide clear path out of the action”.
If part of the bolt system occludes any part of the ejection path, rethink one or the other. Or both.
cheers
eon
“resulting in the empty case being reinserted into the top of the magazine, and re-fed every time. Making it a semi-automatic single-shot.”
This is not semi-automatic single-shot, weapon which is described as such would open breech and eject case automatically then when new cartridge is shoveled it close breech automatically (see for example 45-mm gun 20-K).
What you described is peculiar form of [manual] repeating pistol, that is it need to be cycled after every shot.
Soundness of a design comes with the details. Misfitting a little need even destroys the whole basis. This prototype has over designed features like toggle combined with common lug and counter recess lock but has no firing pin and its engagements, has a stirrup type trigger bar moving solely back and forth against a rotating trigger, has a grip safety seamlessly linked to the trigger. Mr. Ross seems drowned within his thoughts.
All that machining for an incomplete gun, sort of makes 3D printing look like a really good idea.
The recoil spring on the Schwarzlose would have cured the inability of the Ross toggle to fully align.
That’s the impression that I got of Chafl, looking through his patents, he’s not quite as nutty as Gabbet Fairfax, but he’s not far off.
He tries to cram too many ideas in to his designs, rather than actually de bugging a balanced design.
You can contrast him with Browning, who didn’t come from a landed family, and who had to make guns that people wanted to buy, to earn his (and his brothers) living.
“You can contrast him with Browning”
Most Soviet fire-arms who attain success, started from working with fire-arms in some way, but not designing it – for example Shpagin was machinist.
Thus it give them ability to see what is available, aswell provoke to think how that can be done better?
“You can contrast him with Browning”
Comparison with John D. Pedersen is also interesting. If both showed original approach in their design, Pedersen was able to do de bugging a balanced design and also apparently analyzed carefully his designs, for example his US Patent 1,348,733 “AUTOLOADING FIREARM” has 262 patent claims and 19 sheets of drawings.
http://pdfpiw.uspto.gov/.piw?PageNum=1&docid=01348733&IDKey=0B46281CAB77&HomeUrl=http%3A%2F%2Fpatft.uspto.gov%2Fnetacgi%2Fnph-Parser%3FSect1%3DPTO1%2526Sect2%3DHITOFF%2526d%3DPALL%2526p%3D1%2526u%3D%25252Fnetahtml%25252FPTO%25252Fsrchnum.htm%2526r%3D1%2526f%3DG%2526l%3D50%2526s1%3D1348733.PN.%2526OS%3DPN%2F1348733%2526RS%3DPN%2F1348733
Whoa! An IPSC pistol from 1903! O.o
I wonder if the Schwarzlose MG could be redesigned to use that sort of toggle. It wasn’t a locked breech design, instead relying upon a an unlocked but mechanically disadvantageous toggle, bolt inertia and a strong recoil spring. This of course necessitated a short barrel to avoid excessive (for the action) chamber pressure and consequent increased rearward thrust on the bolt.
“short barrel”
Czechoslovak version for 7.9×57 has longer barrel
http://modernfirearms.net/machine/at/schwarzlose-m07-12-e.html